Cita de: Nevie en Enero 27, 2015, 11:10:26 AM
Si logra hacer un juego de rol ágil y a la vez profundo, va a ser el juego del año. Los juegos de rol son una molestia cuando se llega a una edad con poco tiempo libre. El detalle de que cueste mucho subir de nivel es genial. Me hallo a la espera de este gran proyecto.

Go go go Mauro!

That is the reason why I created Darklight in the first place, an easy game to be played even by people with no experience in RPGs

My designed evolved into the use of the D10, but I am contemplating returning to custom dice because they are easier for people to use and make things faster, the only downside, is that it makes it harder to scale numbers (Especially when you need to level up).

Cita de: Dark Ice Games en Enero 27, 2015, 11:06:48 PM
My designed evolved into the use of the D10, but I am contemplating returning to custom dice because they are easier for people to use and make things faster, the only downside, is that it makes it harder to scale numbers (Especially when you need to level up).

Then use custom D10's (kidding)
I really think the success of Shadows of Brimstone proves that there's a huge market for Tabletot/RPG hybrids, and it looks like Darklight could be a great addition to the family... if the system is agile enough to appeal tabletop players, and deep enough to attract hardcore RPGers like me (who don't have so much spare time anymore)... this could be the game I've been waiting for a long time!!

Cita de: PHER en Enero 28, 2015, 07:53:27 PM
Then use custom D10's (kidding)
I really think the success of Shadows of Brimstone proves that there's a huge market for Tabletot/RPG hybrids, and it looks like Darklight could be a great addition to the family... if the system is agile enough to appeal tabletop players, and deep enough to attract hardcore RPGers like me (who don't have so much spare time anymore)... this could be the game I've been waiting for a long time!!

I was reading through the pdf of SoB, and I am just so surprised at how many similarities I have found with Darklight, including the terminology, almost kind of worrying, I wouldn't want anyone to think we've have copied their work.

Darklight currently uses a D10 system a bit like D&D and brimstone, you roll to see if you hit and then roll for damage, so it is 2 rolls. In SoB I have seen that damage is more complex and you must do a math exercise (like in WQ) everytime you roll, so Strength+DiceRoll-Defence=Wounds. That is something which I am not too convinced it works well (especially with people who are not fast at math). I really want to avoid having to roll twice and add math to it, so I am once again studying the possibility of resolving attack rolls in the same of way of games like Hero Quest and Descend does: Number of dice equal to the attribute against a number of dice equal to deference, the unblocked hits end up being wounds.

This system works really well, the only real issue is when you scale it to higher levels. So if you start the game by using between 2 and 4 dice to attack and 2 dice for defense, by the time you reach level 10 you might end up with 10+ attack dice and 10+ defense dice. So once again I am rattling my brains out to find a better solution, if any of you guys has any good ideas feel free to voice  them!

A hand full of dices is a thing who hardcore RPG gamers love. For me is not so bad.

Translation of question / traducción de la pregunta:

¿Sabéis algún método para evitar tener que lanzar 10+ dados para ataque y defensa en niveles altos de personaje?

Well mauro,  sob its similar to warhammer quest so it is easy than both systems (sob and memento mori) are similar: both are based in the aame game: warhammer quest. 

Maybe custom dice are the solution but I think d10 its more original

Para que estemos todos contentos dados de 10 personalizados jeje

Cita de: hardhead en Enero 29, 2015, 03:13:16 PM
Well mauro,  sob its similar to warhammer quest so it is easy than both systems (sob and memento mori) are similar: both are based in the aame game: warhammer quest. 

Maybe custom dice are the solution but I think d10 its more original

If you do not think Shadow of Brimstone is too complicated I am glad, because that opens more possibilities.

I am trying to be as original as possible, but we do not want to reinvent the wheel

The problem with Custom dice:

The warrior starts with Might 4, which means he uses 4 dice when he attacks, you can level up to 10, so you can add Might point (IF you spend them all in Might), meaning you will end up with Might 13, plus you will be having magic weapons and trinkets which raises your Might value between 3-5, for a grand total of 18. Now, monsters of level 10 might end up having Defence 8-10, so you will have to roll 18+10 dice each time you attack a monster, so 28.

That's a little too much!

So, how about the following instead (This is with simple d6).

Attack
Speed:3
Accuracy:4+
Damage:2(+M)

Roll a number of d6 equal to speed (3).
For each dice which scores 4 or more (Accuracy), you have scored a Hit
For every Hit you score you add the Damage value of 2, then add your Might value.
Subtract the Defence of your target to your total  and you have  Wounds scored.

Simple enough?

I'm "thinking out loud" in this post, so don't take me too seriously but...
So weapons with higher speed and less damage could end up doing more damage than others with less speed and more damage.
Maybe speed could be modified by a skill like dexterity, opposite to might, which means characters could be strong with few devastating attacks, or nimble with many feeble attacks, or balanced. For example:
Dagger: Speed 3+Dex, Accuracy 5 Damage 2+ Might
Short Sword: Speed 1 + Dex, Accuracy 4, Damage 4 + Might
2 handed sword: Speed  Dex +0, minimum 1, Accuracy 2, Damage 8 + Might, minimum might requirement: 4
So a character that gets 5 point to distribute con use:
Rogue-like character, Might 1, Dex 4
Attack with dagger, roll 7 dice, for every 5+ (you need more accuracy to hit with a small weapon) do 3 damage. Average 9-12 damage
Attack with short sword, roll 5 dice, for every 4+ do 5 damage (average 10-15)

Balanced character, Might 3 Dex 2
Attack with short sword, throw 3 dice, for every 4+ do 7 damage. Average 14-21 damage.

"Strong" character, Might 4 dex 1, attack with 2 handed sword, throw 2 dice, if 2 or more deal 13 damage (very consistant damage, average 13-26! with the problem of 1 dex, that could hinder other skill tests)

This could be tweaked to give "warrior" types some bonuses, like wielding dual weapons, or getting speed, accuracy or damage bonus with their chosen weapons...
Combine with giving characters with more dex the initiative in combat, having weapons with different skill requirements, special effects (dagger's accuracy lowers when flanking or attacking from the rear, great for rogue-like characters, spears that can attack from 2 squares but the accuracy raises to 6 if attacking an adjacent character, blunt weapons that deal x2 damage to skeletons and piercing ones half damage...) and you have a very RPGish system.
but maybe this comlicates things too much :S

Traducción a grandes rasgos
Mauro dice que un personaje empieza con "Poder" 4, con lo que tiraría 4 dados de ataque (más bonuses) contra dados de defensa del monstruo. Todo Ok. Pero a nivel 10, tendría Poder 10, más los puntos que se haya subido en Poder, más bonuses... puede llegar a 18, más los 8-10 dados de defensa del monstruo... 26-28 dados es demasiado. Propone otro sistema, con D6

Ataque:
Velocidad 3
Precisión 4+
Daño 2+Poder

Se tiran 3 dados (velocidad), por cada 4+ que se saque se hace (2+poder) de daño, se resta la defensa del monstruo y el resultado son las heridas infligidas.

yo comentaba otra idea, porque así se me antojaba que un personaje rápido hará más daño que un poderoso... si la velocidad la diera por una parte el arma y la modificara un atributo (destreza, por ejemplo) para distinguir entre personajes rápidos y ágiles y lentos y poderosos.
Por ejemplo:
daga
Velocidad 3+destreza
Precisión 5 (es más difícil hacer daño con una daga)
Daño 2+Poder

Espada corta
Velocidad 1 + Destreza
Precisión 4
Daño 4 + Poder

Espadón
Velocidad 0+Destreza
Precisión 3
Daño 8+poder
Requisito mínimo: Poder 4

Repartiendo 5 puntos entre los 2 atributos quedaría
Personaje "Pícaro"
Destreza 4 poder 1
atacando con daga, lanza 7 dados, por cada 5+ hace 3 de daño (de media entre 9 y 12)

con espada corta lanza 4 dados, por cada 4 o más hace 5 de daño (de media 10)

Personaje "equilibrado"
Poder 3 destreza 2
Con espada corta, lanza 3 dados, por cada 4+ hace 7 de daño, media 7-14

Personaje "poderoso"

Destreza 1 Poder 4
Con espadón, lanza 2 dados, por cada 2 ó más hace 13 de daño (de media 13-26!)

Todo esto con ajustes tipo "la daga baja a precisión 3 cuando flanqueas o atacas por detrás", los personajes guerreros ganan bonos de atauqe, precisión con una arma elegida, etc... quedaría algo muy rolero, pero... demasiado complicado?

The problem with adding Dexterity to speed is that you make the Archer class the most powerful in melee.

Archer
Dex:4
Might:3

Warrior
Dex 3
Might 4:

Warrior with Sword:
Speed:3
Damage:2+(4 Might)

This means the warrior can do a maximum of 10 damage. 3x2+4

Archer with Sword:
Speed:4
Damage:2+(3 Might)

This means the archer can do a maximum of 11 damage. 4x2+3

Plus the same problem remains, if you raise your "Dexterity" to 18, you still roll 18 dice of speed, while the warrior only rolls 3-4

Aaaaand that's why I buy games instead of designing them
By the way, Mauro, having you here discussing your project with us so openly is an amazing experience! Thanks again!

I just want to make sure I am exploring every possibility before moving forward, and who has more experience in games than the players themselves

Yo sigo pensando que el acabar tirando 10 dados en una tirada de ataque en un dungeoncrawler es inevitable, la gracia es ir creciendo y esto es sintoms de ello....cierto es que puedes llegar a tirar 13 dados, pero a costa de subirte solo el atributo de fuerza dejando de lado el resto de atributos, cosa que quizá no sea muy recomendable. El sistema inicial que proponía Mauro de tirar los Hero Dice y los Monster Dice juntos me parecio brillante, pero para evitar tener que tirar cantidades ingentes de dados, siempre podemos recurrir al jugador de la derecha para lanzar los Monster Dice.

thats true than as you raise level with your character, there is a lot of dice to use...

Mauro, you have thought about lower the initial dice you throw? as a brainstorming idea, you can have 4 of strength, but you only throw half of this dice?

ej:

Strength 4, rolls 2 dice.

Dextery 3, rolls two dice: 1d10 dice, and  1d6 (because 3 it is not divisible).

Inteligence 6, rolls 3 dice

and so on.

what do you think? it is only an idea jeje, not know if it can work

Or you can lower the initial stats:

you want strength 4 for your initial hero, so you put strength 2.

Sorry if they are not good ideas jeje

Another idea could be that sometimes you get fixed value and other times an extra die depending of the level.